I’ve been creating various types of sequencers lately. Usually they have some form of probabilistic or generative aspects to them so that as I improvise live in Max I’m reacting to and engaging with the little environments I create. However sometimes I struggle with creating interesting rhythmic variety - particularly for melodic components. I find it’s very easy to get overly chaotic in max and I use that as a crutch often. When in doubt, I know I can just go full on into chaotic freak-out mode. But I like being able to pull things back to more straight-forward rhythms too.
I have used counter-based sequencers with modulo and various probability based techniques to get non-repeating rhythms. But I’m not completely happy with this approach. With a counter it often feels like I’m stuck with one rhythmic pulse (like 16th notes). Even if a note doesn’t play on every count because of probabilities, it still feels very rigid to me if that makes sense. I’d like to find new ways to create interesting patterns that allow me to have varying note lengths..
In this screenshot is one example I’ve played with. Basically using a multislider to multiply or divide a base tempo. This can then be used to vary note lengths for more interest.
So I’m curious what other techniques people use. Any tips, tricks, or suggestions you’d like to share?
https://preview.redd.it/ff1lma5l2ri61.png?width=789&format=png&auto=webp&s=10c0ae5657d5fa46e400bb10dbc2d4e95a9db985
> The panther has been Cartier's leitmotif for more than a century. The first time the Paris-based jewelry company … alluded to the graceful jungle cat was in 1914, when the house created a women's platinum wristwatch with a case that resembled an abstracted version of the elegant animal's spots, in onyx and diamonds.
— Nancy Hass, The New York Times, 26 Aug. 2020
I have a question about the construction of melodic phrases out of motives. I've been reading Steven laitz complete musician, and having finished the appendix on the motive I am a bit confused. Is the melodic phrase meant to be entirely composed out of 1 motive? If so, how would any adaptation be done to the motive to fit the harmonic changes of the phrase, while maintaining the integrity of the motive ? Transposition will not always work to adapt it to the changing harmony, and I can't imagine it would sound particularly fluid, so is the creating of a melodic line based on filling in the areas that the motive can't be restated in, or the use of other motifs to combine in the phrase?
Thanks for any answers in advance, though I'll probably end up replying anyway so I'm saying this for no real reason!
Hey everyone!
Lately, I've been trying to approach composing melodies from a slightly different perspective: Essentially, instead of starting with chords and harmony, I've been experimenting with writing a rhythmic framework first.
What's that? Well, imagine playing the melody of Autumn Leaves on a snare drum (or any unpitched percussion instrument, really). Even though all the harmonic and pitch-related information is missing, the melody still retains it's structure, phrases, accents, dynamics...
Someone who already knows the song might even recognize it. It seems like all well-known melodies feature a solid, convincing rhythmic structure underneath.
Of course, this is hardly newsworthy, everyone who's ever played an instrument knows that rhythm is the foundation of pretty much anything musical.
However, for some reason, I had never really considered using that same logic when actually composing melodies. Usually I'd start with chords and harmony, scales, melodic intervals or at best, by developing motifs.
So, back to rhythmic frameworks. Here's one I just wrote recently: https://musescore.com/user/28196196/scores/5450877
- So, it's a short piece and it's using only percussion instruments.
- There's an 'A' and a 'B' section.
- The three instruments (A, B and C) are only placeholders and can be replaced by any instrument (pitched or unpitched).
- For example, C could an electric bass playing roots, a piano playing block chords or a horn section, [...]
Having a framework like this already in place now allows me to fully concentrate on finding interesting harmonic, melodic and timbral possibilities. Which certainly helps my composing process.
At some point I figured that this could be an interesting exercise as well. So if anyone's interested, feel free to download the framework (either as a PDF, Midi or MusicXML file) and try to turn it into an actual piece of music by filling the framework with pitches, chords and harmony.
Maybe we could turn this into some kind of community challenge? We could even share our results in this thread and see how many different directions we can take this basic framework in?
So, anyone interested?
My main issue is when I try and focus on the chords and hitting the right notes with the changes I lose all sense of melody. When I just play the scale without thinking about the chords I sound much better (though still not very good). I know in order to start sounding very good I have to learn to hit those chords notes and build melodic phrases around them.
I’m trying to find music that my band could use. We consist of a female singer, a guitarist, a bassist, a saxophonist (alto, if I recall correct), a drummer and me, who plays soprano on steel pan so chords don’t do much for my part. I need some melodic phrases that still counts as background.
For instance: when everybody else voted yes, our singer had to veto against A-HA’s “Take On Me” because she couldn’t see how she would be able to sing it properly, which made me a bit sad because just listen to all that background melody I could play out!
We are also looking for something “popular/well known”, just so there’s a good chance publicum would recognize but less know songs etc are very welcome!
I have Toto’s “Africa” on my wishlist for now, but I hope people have some suggestions that can help greatly!
First off, the song is fairly recent (maybe in the last 2-5 years max). The vocal shout comes up near the end of the song as an extension to give some more time to the last drop. It's also been pitch shifted up. I don't believe the song title has any connection to the vocal shout in question, and IIRC it's only said once in the song (although I be wrong, I'm only 80% sure it's said once).
Well, thanks to all those who try👍
Recording of (what I think is) a bit of the melody on guitar
Just what it says on the tin—I don't have any intuition about the composer or anything, but I do remember a bit of the melody. I also have the slight suspicion that the second half of what I play is just my brain filling in a generic descending melody, but I'm pretty sure about the first half. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
So I have a melody in C maj. It's comprised of four phrases, and each phrase goes over an Am-F-C-G chord progression. So each phrase ends over a G chord. Phrase one and two both end on a D. Which is the 2nd of C, and the 5th of G. Phrase three ends on a G which is the 5th of C and root of G, so that seems strong. Phrase four ends passing through the D and then back to C, to get home at the end of the melody.
I wrote the melody thinking about D as the 5th of G so it seemed legit. But singing the phrase that final note is hard to get right and only seems to work with the perfect syllable (it's a vocal line). Now I'm thinking that as the 2nd of C, it might be too dissonant.
So I guess my first question is do I consider the D as the 2nd of C first, or the 5th of G? Or is it something in between that I just have to figure out what I can get away with in terms of dissonance?
And second question how much fire am I really playing with here? Obviously it's not that dissonant, I haven't gone chromatic. But I am ending a phrase with it, and I have noticed that note in particular being difficult to sing. Is this just dissonant enough to be interesting or should I play it safe and get back down to C in every phrase except the third phrase?
The question is simple but requires a little explaining. After listening to Phish for a while, you start to pick up on melodies, ideas and sounds that reappear in jams. They can be short licks on the guitar, or entire musical melody provided by the cohered effort of the whole band. One of my favorite melodies that Trey plays is something he started using in 97, and has popped up more frequently in 99. I'll link a few examples of the melody I'm referring to.
Gumbo Starlake 97: https://youtu.be/PwAkVP0V8wY?t=13m48s (it starts at 13:54)
Wolfman's Brother 99: http://www.phishtracks.com/shows/1999-09-24/wolfman-s-brother (played at 12:40-ish)
I just am curious as to what this is in terms of music theory. I wish i were well trained in music theory, haha. I'm also curious to what you folks of r/phish like.
It's used in a lot of video games, especially Nintendo games. It starts by suspending on one note, and then quickly descending down three tones.
It's in the original Pokemon Theme
The Ocarina of Time Menu Theme
you can also hear it at 2:18 in this song from that game
and 0:45 in this song from melee, though it's a little quiet here
Is there any kind of recognition of this in music theory? Does it have a name?
I heard this song once and it's been stuck in my head ever since but I didn't save it. I thought it was by Marshmello but I combed through his catalogue to no avail.
I'm not sure how new it is; it might be brand new or it might be a few years old but I don't think it's like 10 years old or anything. Pretty sure I first heard it as part of a music video too and it might have been colorful and kind of psychadelic.
I think it might sound trap-ish and there's a single male vocal singing in the spaced out silence before the drop of what my recording is based on. Speaking of which, I kind of made up a loose memory of what it sounds like, but the most important part is the repeating line a few seconds in and at the very end. The rest I just kind of tried to loosely fill in the gaps.
Hope I provided enough details and thank you all in advance!
https://vocaroo.com/i/s1oTMjISrTQP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awGPIpELgCA&list=RDawGPIpELgCA&start_radio=1
From 0:56, out of nowhere Bucket starts his very melodic solo.
1:30 - 1:45 is also fire with cool ending to the solo
Go check this track out.
I’m mostly looking in a rock/pop vocal melody context. I find when I write I use the same phrasing over and over again and it’s kind of stale to me. It doesn’t really jump out as much as I’d like. And I like guys like Cobain and Elliott Smith, Beatles, etc. who were really great at placing their melodies. So what I’m wondering is if there’s any sort of theory analysis strictly for melodic phrasing beyond just looking at where notes fall on a staff. And how to implement it besides just trying to listen and replicate.
