I've been studying Methodism a little bit lately, and there was something that really appealed to me there, something called the Wesleyan Quadrilateral.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wesleyan_Quadrilateral
The TLDR is that Methodists approach spiritual questions by looking at:
-
Scripture
-
Sacred Tradition IE church history
-
Personal Experiences
-
Reason
Scripture has greater weight than the other three to Methodists, but they see value in examining all four of these principles.
This makes sense to me, and I think this is a healthier way of approaching spiritual questions than what is often practiced in the church by some.
I know many Latter-Day Saints who cling to their personal experiences, their burning bosom moment where they felt the Spirit testify of truth, and completely neglect the other three aspects mentioned above when they think about why they believe what they believe.
I think that sets us up for failure. Those experiences absolutely are important, but we need to consider the context of church history, the scriptures themselves, and reason as we try to make sense of our faith. And I feel like too many of us when difficult questions arise, we just stick our head in the sand, say "that isn't faith promoting" and focus entirely on what we have felt from the Spirit instead of trying to answer the question.
Truth is truth, and if your faith conflicts with your reason/philosophy then you either don't understand the gospel correctly or your philosophy needs to be re-examined. The world should make more sense to you because of your faith, not less. Reason isn't the most important part of answering spiritual questions but it should be part of our approach.
For me, taking this quadrilateral approach strengthens my testimony of the restoration and makes my faith more spiritually satisfying to me.
What do you think?
Anyone have suggestions here? I can find sermons from UM Pastors, but I don’t find anything really discussion UM/Wesleyan theology. Nothing scripture study or anything. Surely there is something out there in podcast land??
Demographics: AFAB nonbinary lesbian, Midwest, low-income cc student (went to a v large public school, non-feeder), Princeton legacy (father went to their theological seminary), first-gen American, speak a relatively obscure European language as a first language
Intended Major(s): Russian Lang & Lit - At some schools, I double it with either Comparative Literature or Art History
ACT/SAT/SAT II: applying TO because I took the ACT once without studying, had an abysmal score, but couldn't retake it due to testing centers being closed from COVID and now I have way too many obligations to study ahh
UW/W GPA and Rank: Graduated hs w/ a weighted 3.9 something?? Not the best, but I did fail two classes my sophomore year due to v serious extenuating circumstances. Had an uber strong upward trend since then and still graduated in the top quartile of my class but meh. In cc, I got a 4.0 every semester since then and my degree gpa is a 3.85 unweighted that factored in one or two b's from hs
Coursework: From HS: 9 - AP Euro (4), 10 - APUSH (4), 11 - AP Gov (4), 12 - AP Bio (3), AP Studio Art (3), and self-studied AP Lit (5)
I tested out of French 1 my freshman year of hs due to self-studying the language in 8th grade and started taking dual enrollment courses right then and there. After graduating, I immediately took summer classes at cc (9 creds in total, 4 classes) and took 16 credit hours in the fall. Still taking anywhere from 14-16 credits next semester. I genuinely want to study Russian more in-depth in a collegiate setting but it's not available at my cc, so I've been taking Italian.
Awards: AP Scholar with Distinction, some hs graduation honors local to my school in addition to a Presidential Award, full-tuition merit scholarship at my cc, other local small scholarships here and there, Dean's List, PTK, chosen as one of top 2 students on campus for All-USA team (got recommended to fill out Jack Kent Cooke by nominator :0??), Associate of Art with Honors earned just this fall semester
Extracurriculars: Hoo boy this might be long. Not including everything lil thing I did in hs but before Covid, I did folk dancing for 13+ years. Wasn't able to seek employment in hs since I had to take care of my nonverbal sibling on the autism spectrum probably 20+ hrs/wk while my parents worked. One parent is actually physically disabled so I sometimes help them with fixing cars or things around the house. Senior year, I had two
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As a card carrying Bible waving Reformed Baptist I thought I had this shit down pat. Jesus fuck was I wrong.
All I'm trying to do is categorize denominations according to their history and theology. Easier said than done.
Fundamentalism, Liberalism, Pentacostalism, Neo-Orthodoxy, and Evangelicalism. Many baptists are Fundamentalists. However many others can be Evangelical. Still others can be Arminian/Wesleyan. Presbyterians likewise can be Fundamentalist and Evangelical while still the same remaining Reformed. But wait there's more. Methodists, Presbyterians, Pentacostals, Baptists(obviously,) are all broken down into dozens, hundreds, even thousands of denominations. Some are Evangelical. Some are Fundamentalists. Some are liberal. Some are both Evangelical and Fundamentalist.
What the fuck man? I thought I was fairly educated given my background but I dont know how they do it. I don't think Christians even know how convoluted this shit truly is.
I just want to make sense of it so I can neatly place each sect into clearly defined blocks so my autistic brain can have some peace.
I was going to try and make sense of Roman Catholicism but honestly after about 30 minutes I think I'd rather kill myself.
Sorry for grammar I'm on mobile.
Greetings fellow Wesleyan/Methodists! I recently started a podcast where I examine theological themes within the beautiful genre of Science Fiction. It’s called Theology in Sci-Fi. The first episode is all about the first Matrix film.
More information here – https://theologyinscifi.podbean.com/
Listen here - https://open.spotify.com/show/3A6uKlshe2MBNLcYsOUpXf
Thank you.
Hello all,
I am currently a biblical studies undergrad with plans to pursue an MA in biblical studies/biblical exegesis. I was raised pentecostal (Foursquare) and my theology would hold to much of what "typical pentecostalism" (however separate from Wesleyanism / the holiness pentecostalism movement). My question is this, are there any strong programs in biblical studies (specifically exegesis and study of Hebrew/Greek) that won't shun me as a pentecostal :). The main schools on my radar are Fuller Theological Seminary, in Pasadena, Ca, Wheaton College, as well as Portland Seminary out of Geroge Fox University.
Thanks.
On Reddit, there are several subreddits dedicated to the various streams of Christianity. Currently, there is not a place for Wesleyans outside of the (wonderful) Methodist subreddit, and many Wesleyans find themselves part of churches that may not be distinctly Methodist in identity, while still retaining Wesleyan theology.
The intent is this subreddit is simple: to be a place to discuss all things Wesleyan: theology, polity, Wesley's writings and teachings, current denominations and events, revival, learn more about the tradition, etc. People who are not Wesleyan or even Christian are more than welcome to join, consider this a great place to ask questions for the inquisitive.
Merry Christmas Eve!
Majority of us here are reformed or at least Calvinistic. It’ll be natural for us to read and/or listen to a lot of Calvinist theologians/preachers/authors. However, I can name some Arminian authors from whom I profited from. I’m curious if you guys have that too.
I’ll start. Maybe this is too mainstream but C.S. Lewis all the way. He is not even evangelical but some of his thoughts are so compelling that maybe apart from the Bible, he’s the most influential for me. (On a second thought, I dunno if they are in the same level as John Piper for me, though John Piper heavily quotes him anyway.)
Hi everyone. This is my first post here.
My first exposure to reformed theology was a couple of years ago from preachers like Sproul, Washer, and the writings of Matthew Henry. I've listened to these preachers for close to a decade now and I'm starting to realize that those that are still alive are getting old and nearing the end of their earthly journey.
Those that are still alive such as Piper, Washer, and Baucham are often busy with other affairs, and I'm running out of sermons to listen to throughout my day.
What I'm basically asking for is: who should I be listening to and keeping an eye on, considering that many of the reformed leaders we all looked up to in the 2000s and 2010s are passing over into saintly rest?
I'm currently a member of a PCA church but we've been looking for a senior pastor since 2018. I attend church service every other weekend due to my work schedule. In the past, it was enough for me to simply google a recent sermon by Piper, Keller, or Sproul and that would give me food for thought throughout the day. I still do that now when I can but I've started asking myself if I'm missing out on someone else who is preaching truth, especially during these troubling times we find ourselves in.
This isn't about popularity; if you believe your local pastor is hitting off on topics of immediate importance today then please link your church's live streams or sermon archive and I'll take a listen.
Lastly, while I specifically asked for reformed preachers, anyone with an ardent spirit for God's Church is more than welcomed. I've always loved listening to Ravenhill and wouldn't mind listening to another Wesleyan if they had his same vision for the Church.
Thanks for all your help.
Following my first post here, I am taking the encouragement of this group to write a bit about my own experience.
You will not have heard of this group. It's too small to make the news, and if its leaders have done anything illegal enough to warrant press attention despite their obscurity, they did it cleverly enough to get away with it. (More on that later.) Because the leaders are vindictive enough to cause trouble for me if I were identified, I will be using fake names and be vague about geography.
So let's call the group BFC, short for Bible Family Church. It started in a small town in Southwestern Pennsylvania, where the Charismatic Movement was sweeping through the Catholic and mainline Protestant congregations in the mid-to-late 1970s. Ecumenical Bible study and worship groups were popping up, and the established Charismatic and Pentecostal organizations were taking notice. One such organization, "Solid Rock Ministries", sent "apostles" to the group in the hopes of turning it into a SRM franchise.
They brought with it a Wesleyan Holiness ethic that some of the members found intolerable. Not because Holiness teaching forbade certain things—they were fine with that. It was because Wesleyanism wasn't reformed enough for them. At this time, a charismatic or Pentecostal church with a reformed theology was unheard of. But as it would turn out, the leader of this sub-sect (we'll call him SE, for "Senior Elder", a title he held later) didn't particularly care about theological consistency.
Now from here, the story has two versions. One was told to me by BFC's leaders, the other by former members of the Bible study and of BFC. This all happened before I was born, so I had no reason to suspect the official story. Well, that and I was brainwashed into accepting literally everything they said.
In their version, a "religious spirit" attacked the group, causing all but a few to "fall away". Those few would become the charter members of BFC.
In the other version, they started "prophesying" against the group's leadership and SRM, telling the congregation that their leaders were demon possessed, and that God had anointed one man (SP, for Senior Pastor) to lead not just this group, but all the charismatic churches in our region. So they got kicked out, and the group became a SRM church. A few people followed them, but they saw through their bullshit and left soon after.
Either way, this part of the story ends with five members altogether: SE, SP, and three o
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I mean no disrespect, I was raised Wesleyan Methodist, but have been a pagan for a few years now. A lot of the people that I know who are Christians were raised that way and dont seem to have been exposed to a lot of different religions growing up.
My question is, now that you are grown or have access to all of the religions of the world, just about, why do you stay in christianity? What does it offer you that other religions do not? Does it just make the most sense? And do you think it make more sense because it is familiar or of how you were raised, or because it just matches your own thought on philosophy and theology.
For context I'm a Refuse Driver (Garbage man) & today I was on food waste. After I'd tipped I was checking the wagon for any defects when I spotted a lone pea balanced on the lifts.
I said "hey look, an escaPEA"
No one near me but it didn't half make me laugh for a good hour or so!
Edit: I can't believe how much this has blown up. Thank you everyone I've had a blast reading through the replies 😂
It really does, I swear!
I'm surprised it hasn't decade.
They’re on standbi
Buenosdillas
Pilot on me!!
Hi all, I'm still very new to learning about Orthodoxy but would love to hear from other converts. Here's the story: I was raised protestant, but I'm pretty familiar with a few different denominations (baptist, wesleyan, and reformed). More recently, my husband and I were attending a reformed church and unfortunately, the RCA is splitting again. This lead me to begin asking a lot of questions and researching more church history. Long story short, I began to see some gaps in protestant theology in general, and began feeling quite lost about 6 months ago.
This spring, I was visiting a friend in another state for a weekend and was invited to church with them. It was my first time attending an Orthodox liturgy but something about it really stood out to me. It was so beautiful and unlike any modern church service I'd ever experienced. As I kept reading more about it, I became more interested. I found a local parish and have been attending services while also still staying connected to our reformed church as I sort all this out. My main question is, if you were a former protestant turned orthodox, what was the final moment that you knew you wanted to convert? Was there a specific issue or perspective that solidified your position? How did you know when to become a catechumen?
I'd really appreciate your thoughts. This has been a very confusing, yet joyful, and a little bit scary for me over the past several months. I just want to go where God is leading me and to find a spiritual home. Thanks.
Looking for a summary on how Wesleyan churches differ from reformed churches, in theology and practice. I'd also love suggestions of resources to learn more.
No personal stake in this, just curiosity. I don't have a good understanding of methodism in general, and I'd love to learn.
Dad jokes are supposed to be jokes you can tell a kid and they will understand it and find it funny.
This sub is mostly just NSFW puns now.
If it needs a NSFW tag it's not a dad joke. There should just be a NSFW puns subreddit for that.
Edit* I'm not replying any longer and turning off notifications but to all those that say "no one cares", there sure are a lot of you arguing about it. Maybe I'm wrong but you people don't need to be rude about it. If you really don't care, don't comment.
When I got home, they were still there.
What did 0 say to 8 ?
" Nice Belt "
So What did 3 say to 8 ?
" Hey, you two stop making out "
I won't be doing that today!
You take away their little brooms
This morning, my 4 year old daughter.
Daughter: I'm hungry
Me: nerves building, smile widening
Me: Hi hungry, I'm dad.
She had no idea what was going on but I finally did it.
Thank you all for listening.
There hasn't been a post all year!
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Hello all,
I am currently a biblical studies undergrad with plans to pursue an MA in biblical studies/biblical exegesis. I was raised pentecostal (Foursquare) and my theology would hold to much of what "typical pentecostalism" (however separate from Wesleyanism / the holiness pentecostalism movement). My question is this, are there any strong programs in biblical studies (specifically exegesis and study of Hebrew/Greek) that won't shun me as a pentecostal :). The main schools on my radar are Fuller Theological Seminary, in Pasadena, Ca, Wheaton College, as well as Portland Seminary out of Geroge Fox University.
Thanks.
