Nested dimensions, narrative structure and the meaning of f. v.redd.it/va8qvgbfyl471
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πŸ‘€︎ u/badwolf312
πŸ“…︎ Jun 11 2021
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Player Agency vs Railroading. Approaches to Narrative Structure in Video Games

https://youtu.be/SM5ikVbIupc

In this video I discuss the concept of narrative structure in both traditional media and video games, comparing the two approaches and how gaming, as an interactive medium can distinguish itself from tradition. I look at games that largely use their gameplay to portray narrative such as Dark Souls and Gris and discuss the merits of this technique. Equally, I look at the balance between player agency and rigidity and how too much of one and not enough of the other can lead to an inconsistent approach. Then discussing an example of how this balance can be struck and the benefits of this.

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πŸ‘€︎ u/DiscussingGames
πŸ“…︎ May 10 2021
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Narrative Structures in Dreams?

There is a very prominent type of dream I have that I almost never see discussed or even alluded to elsewhere.

Many of my dreams play out as narratives, often featuring narrative structures that imply a great deal of premeditation. I am usually not present in these dreams and experience them only as visions, feeling the emotions of the characters strongly, sometimes selectively watching things unfold over longer windows of time than you would describe as typical. I do not find dissecting narratives to be especially productive or stimulating, but if I were to pick a typical dream apart, I could identify some familiar, deliberately placed elements: plot twists, setups and payoffs, a clear ending of some kind, etc. It is less than surprising to me that my unconscious might speak via narratives, as I’ve always loved storytelling and had an intuitive connection with it. I began writing fiction when I was eight years old and today I’m a filmmaker, but I was dreaming in narratively structured visions for far longer than I was articulate in storytelling conventions.

I have never seen this kind of dreaming acknowledged elsewhere and am curious to hear other people’s thoughts. What are your experiences with narrative dreams? How common do you believe them to be? Do you think there are any effective generalities to be made about the distinction between dreams that are experienced and dreams witnessed as visions? Did Jung have any specific commentary on this?

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πŸ‘€︎ u/J-T-L
πŸ“…︎ May 29 2021
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If Any Of You Here Miss The Narrative Structure Of GOT Then I Recommend The Movie Cloud Atlas... youtu.be/hWnAqFyaQ5s
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πŸ‘€︎ u/CCV21
πŸ“…︎ Jun 06 2021
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Approaches to Narrative Structure in Game Design youtu.be/SM5ikVbIupc
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πŸ‘€︎ u/DiscussingGames
πŸ“…︎ May 12 2021
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(Spoilers Extended) Narrative Structure in The Winds of Winter

The Winds of Winter is very much a book I look forward to reading, as do all of us. There's been a lot of discussion of specific theories and predictions for it, but today I want to take a larger look at what I think we should expect in the book, and what the narrative will be. It's fair to say that after the slower pace of A Feast for Crows/A Dance with Dragons, Winds is going to be much faster paced, and be packed with plot, comparable to A Storm of Swords. However, I don't think this necessarily needs to mean that people will be traveling to where they need to be super quickly.

Character Development & Why Nobody Is Going Anywhere For At Least a Little Bit

Okay, the title is a bit of an exaggeration, let me explain.

Currently, we still have a lot of characters in far off places away from the main plot. Arya is in Braavos, Sam is in Oldtown, Dany is still in Essos, Davos was last seen being told to head to Skagos, Jaime is about to meet Stoneheart... of course, that must mean that Winds is going to be the book where all these characters get to where they need to, in order for the story to progress, right? I think that's true, but not necessarily the way we might imagine.

For instance, after reading Mercy, a lot of us expect Arya to leave Braavos immediately after, and with Euron's imminent attack on Oldtown, Sam isn't going to stay in Oldtown long, and with Dany she's going to briefly stop at Vaes Dothrak and then return to Meereen. It's easy to see how we might think the story has to hurry up in order for it to wrap up, but I think it undermines what is supposed to be happening. Plot is important, but imo, can only speed up when character development has been earned. In this case, what is the purpose of Arya being in Braavos? What is the purpose of Sam being in Oldtown? Or Dany being in the Dothraki sea again?

Yes, Arya is training with the Faceless Men and struggling to let go of her Stark identity (something she cannot do), Sam is going to the Citadel to learn shit, Dany's (probable) return to Vaes Dothrak is gonna end in her uniting all the Dothraki. But these are just plot points, and don't get at the heart of why these characters are in these situations. What does being here do to progress their own development? I've previously talked about Dany being in Vaes Dothrak is to help her figure out her own purpose and use her new found decision to embrace fire and blood to finally figure out what she will do further into the s

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πŸ‘€︎ u/AngeryTargaryen
πŸ“…︎ Apr 14 2021
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Narrative Structure in Video Games youtu.be/SM5ikVbIupc
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πŸ‘€︎ u/CamDC123
πŸ“…︎ May 09 2021
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So...picked up the first book about a week and a half ago because I read a few promising reviews. Finished the 3rd book yesterday... it’s like literary crack. Such an enjoyable ride. Is the 4th book worth staying on board for, I read the narrative structure changes a bit in style?
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πŸ‘€︎ u/riftwan
πŸ“…︎ Jan 18 2021
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Mimesis vs. Diegesis: Recommended readings on comparisons between mimetic narrative structure and diegetic narrative structure (e.g., films vs. novels)?

The mimetic vs. diegetic distinction was put forth by Plato, and I've also read Story and Discourse: Narrative Structure in Fiction and Film by Seymour Chatman, as well as his other papers, but I was wondering if anyone could recommend other theorists and articles that have talked about comparing the narrative structure of films and novels. I'm looking to study narratology for my PhD, and I'm really curious about comparing narrative structure in different formats.

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πŸ‘€︎ u/cm_kitschklock
πŸ“…︎ Mar 24 2021
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Is there a name for the narrative structure of placing an ending scene at the beginning of a text?

For example, in the opening of the movie Climax, the final scene is shown before the story even begins. This is a structure likewise used throughout literature. Prolepsis doesn’t quite convey the feature. Therefore, is there any specific term for it?

Perhaps it could be deemed β€œin medias res” but then again, it doesn’t really begin in the middle of things. Nor, does it begin ab ovo...

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πŸ‘€︎ u/sheephamlet
πŸ“…︎ Mar 16 2021
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Books with different/innovative type of non linear narrative structure beyond standard tropes like where story goes in reverse in each chapter or omnibus style(where three or four different plots meet or related physically or metaphorically)?

House of leaves is innovative with footnotes thing

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πŸ‘€︎ u/coolBurningWater
πŸ“…︎ Mar 30 2021
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Narrative structure modification question: Cut some of the backstory ?

Hello everyone!
I'm running LMoP for my players and beggining to seed some of the content of STK into it to add some build up. I've found a couple ways to link my player's backstories and interests into the game but I keep having the feeling that I won't be able to have some of the story elemnts become interesting to the players:

The book opens with a long description of the Storm Giant's court with several people there, one actually dead before the campaign starts, betrayal, deception, etc.
I can't imagine how to convey any of this to characters so that they would actually care for it, and I imagine that by the time they get to Maelstrom it's a little to late and I would have to be extremely obvious with the RP for them to make sense of the situation (Serissa being super nice, her sisters super evil, the dragon super shady and also obvious ?) It's like most of the story already happened in the background by the time the characters learn any of it and even if I loredump it before, they have no real reason to care for it.

I've been thinking on cutting most of it (the 2 sisters for example) and having maelstrom be a more expeditious and misterious location, not very investigative but more of an alien and "bigger that the players can take" set of scenes, so as to keep it interesting and not as cartoony as I'm thinking it may be. The more simplistic or problematic elements of it (how did no one realize the dragon is a dragon, how come the sisters were so eager to kill their own mother, why wasn't she brought back, why does no one solve the coin mistery) would be covered in mistery behind the scenes.
I think this way they would have more time to visit more giant lords and the endgame would be more dynamic.
That's my reasoning but I doubt a little so I would ask any who reads this:

If you have played or DM the campaign: Am I missreading the act and the story? Did the party care/become involved in the matters of the court? Did it feel a little lore-dumpy or was the intrigue enough build up that they were interested?

And also: would removing the sisters cause any complicated issue? Is not getting to explore Maesltrom a great loss if I'm to use as some awe-inspiring location for some revelations and story development?

Thank you in advance!!

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πŸ‘€︎ u/Vinobina2
πŸ“…︎ Mar 02 2021
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The Prestige's narrative structure is kinda like Inception + Memento

Like Inception's dream within a dream, The Prestige has a diary within a diary.

The movie starts with the third act. Then it transitions to the second act by having Borden read a diary describing the second act. Then it transitions to the first act by having Angier read a diary describing the first act. Then all the three acts unfold simultaneously, just like all the dreams in Inception. And all the three acts have to be time dilated with respect to each other.

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πŸ‘€︎ u/fbi747
πŸ“…︎ Feb 26 2021
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This is the second episode of my series on Christopher Nolan. I thought Following was really the only film from Nolan that could be classified as straight film noir, but aside from playing with narrative structure, this flick is noir to the bone. youtu.be/Kh2aD9V9X6U
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πŸ‘€︎ u/filmfreak17
πŸ“…︎ Mar 19 2021
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Do your dreams have a narrative end? Or any narrative structure?

I realized while reading about someone else's dream that mine usually either have a storyline like a movie or tv show, or they just feel like my everyday life, with things happening around me. I also realized I almost never have a narrative conclusion to my dreams, so I've never had a dream that felt "finished," I just have stories that are interrupted when I wake up. Do yours have clear defined start, middle, and end? Are things wrapped up nicely, or left open ended?

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πŸ‘€︎ u/glibjibb
πŸ“…︎ Feb 22 2021
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Narrative Structure in Games and Why It Differs From Books and Movies youtube.com/watch?v=yG0Vw…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/dr4v3nn
πŸ“…︎ Dec 15 2020
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[Discussion] Re Zero objectively has one of the best narrative structures in media
  • It's spoiler-resistant, in a weird way. Hearing someone died, lost their mind, or got crippled doesn't function as a shocking revelation. It's simply an occurence to note, due to the "canon" timeline still being indeterminate without a lot of context. It's hard to spoil series deaths because nearly everyone has died by now.

  • The stakes maintain their urgency. It's not about subjecting beloved characters to pain that worries us, but whether or it it gets "locked in" by the route. As such, every instance of harm is relevant because of the uncertainty of it being something that doesn't get undone.

  • There's no "plot armor" for any of the cast, except for the one case that has it as his actual power. The bulk of the supporting cast meet grim fates in the discarded timelines, ranging from insanity torturous deaths.

  • The supporting cast also get more facets showcased in their personality compared to other styles. I mean, for fuck's sake Rem spent the better part of her introductory arc murdering Subaru, and she's a beloved character both in and out of universe.

Objectively speaking, Re Zero appears to have one of the most compelling narrative structures I've ever seen, because the looping makes everything absolutely relevant until proven otherwise, characters get to develop divergently and pointedly due to loops, and a very nice progression of stakes.

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πŸ‘€︎ u/CobaltArkangel
πŸ“…︎ Sep 24 2020
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My ideal narrative structure of Cyberpunk

Act 1 – Open world RPG

  • This is your rise to the top story. You will grind your levels here. Thematically this makes since. Initially this is presented as 6 months to the final act as just a few weeks. We can let this first act represent 6 moths, a year, or a little more if we want. The major focus is on you and Jackie taking missions (together and separate) and moving up

  • Scrap life path at the beginning (or completely)

  • IF you want life paths, V can take jobs from corpo fixers, street fixers, nomad fixers. You can start to favor one and move up in their ranks. Gaining fame and better apartments. As you favor one faction, the others wont hate you, but will stop giving quests. It’s just business.

  • OR you are street kid and you can start to gain territory for a fixer. The remnants of the displaced gangs can send people to attack you from time to time (not during missions). Other fixers become more antagonistic in their dealings with you if you are in their territory.

  • Either way your influence wont really affect the ending too much

  • Early missions introduce River, Panam, and Judy (and maybe a couple more) friends/love interests who will keep giving missions as friendship/flirting continues. Goal is to romance one early while allowing friendship to grow with others through hang out missions or other favors (gig type quests)

  • As you move up, V starts to get disillusioned while seeing that even though he/she has more status, she’s not that much better off. These violent delights have violent ends. V focuses on friends/partner and their desire to get away from the bullshit in Night City.

  • We are introduced to the Peralez side quest in this half.

In the end, you climb high enough for…

Act 2 – More linear action/adventure

  • Starts with the Heist. You’ve been becoming disillusioned by the trappings of NC and slowly getting frustrated by Jackie’s clinging to the want to move up. This makes the argument in the car feel more appropriate. It was pretty jarring when I heard it. Jackie’s death feels more impactful now that your constant friend for a significant part of the game is gone

  • Game plays much like what we have now. We get chip, we get shot, we get Johnny. I would eliminate the car fight with Takemura driving since, in my mind, it would explain why Arasaka is not actively hunting V. Takemura and goon take V and Dex to the dump. V is shot then rebooted. Takemura kills Dex while goon is on the phone. β€œIt will be done” or

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πŸ‘€︎ u/Craneteam
πŸ“…︎ Jan 09 2021
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Narrative Structure in Slice of Life Anime youtu.be/xLL5I-MlFUc
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πŸ‘€︎ u/thixotrofic
πŸ“…︎ Jan 21 2021
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Narrative Structures in Video Games youtube.com/watch?v=yG0Vw…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/dr4v3nn
πŸ“…︎ Dec 15 2020
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Should I use a linear narrative structure for my online course? blog.tutorpass.io/posts/s…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/tutorpass
πŸ“…︎ Feb 20 2021
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A book with a narrative structure similar to the movie "Memento"

Hi! I am interested in writing a story that would involve two different timelines of events that converge to form one cohesive narrative at the end. The best example I could think of is the movie Memento, but I would love to have some written examples of this story structure to guide my own writing.

Basically, I am looking for suggestions of a book that has both a main timeline and a "flashback/flash sideways" timeline. The events could be told out of order, and it's like a puzzle you put together as you read. Then in the end, everything comes together and all the events make sense.

I really love psychological thrillers, dystopians and even a good romance/love story if any of that helps!

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πŸ‘€︎ u/princessofstuff
πŸ“…︎ Nov 25 2020
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Should I use a linear narrative structure for my online course?

Linear narrative structures are the most widely used and accepted online course format. When instructors use linear narratives, they deliver teaching content with a clear beginning, middle and end. Course linearity seems like a good choice for an instructor looking to create an online course - but what are the benefits and drawbacks?

https://blog.tutorpass.io/posts/should-i-use-a-linear-narrative-structure-for-my-online-course

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πŸ‘€︎ u/tutorpass
πŸ“…︎ Feb 20 2021
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(Spoilers Extended) Narrative structure of A Song of Ice and Fire creates a fictional world with realistic measures of social complexity arxiv.org/pdf/2012.01783.…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/Ultraximus
πŸ“…︎ Dec 08 2020
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Video Essay On Narrative Structure & Content In ABC's Hit Television Series "Lost" (2004-2010) youtu.be/CSx8XdQ18mQ
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πŸ‘€︎ u/kgsullivan
πŸ“…︎ Oct 11 2020
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Career/Pay Question: Compared to high finance (investment banking) and big tech, is the pay structure "flat" in the defense industry, comparatively speaking? Where/how does the "war profiteering" narrative fit in modern times?

In high finance, like i-banking, and jobs that come after i-banking like private equity & hedge funds, there is a lot of revenue split up over a relatively small pool of employees (there aren't that many analysts and associates at the biggest banks, and these are the most junior roles). This explains the comparatively large pool of bonuses, especially as you go up the ladder. The ceiling in high finance is much higher than most industries.

 

In big tech, there are also significantly large revenues split up over a relatively mid-sized pool of employees, so the wage floor is much higher than most industries (such as many junior SWEs starting close to, or at, six figure pay). But the organizational structure is flatter than that of high finance & big banks/big funds (more ppl working in the ranks), so the wage ceiling isn't as high in big tech. But still, very lucrative pay for many people working in big tech.

 

From my observation, the defense industry also sees significant revenues, but there are a lot of junior level & mid management employees in the employee pool - more so than high finance and big tech.

There are many layers of junior to senior engineers, multiple layers of QA/QC folks, wide range of folks doing R&D to testing, and many layers of management (and bureaucracy if I may add) in between and across. There are also many employees doing blue collar work, and the hierarchies that come with that line of work as well.

 

The pay in defense is certainly very comfortable, but it doesn't seem as lucrative as high finance or big tech, and many employees are content with spending their whole career making comfortable pay without going all the way to the top. It seems like there is no "up or out" structure within the industry as you see with finance.

It seems like the big revenue is split up over the many employees within the defense industry, spanning many different states (not just concentrated in NYC/SF/Silicon Valley). It looks like most of the money made in defense, is going into paying a lot of people's payroll across the country, and thus, the profits aren't necessary concentrated at the top, like you see with high finance MDs (bonuses) & big tech execs (stock comp). Instead it seems like there is a lot of ppl making a comfortable living within the defense industry.

 

But there is still the overwhelming public notion and narrative that the defense industry is "war profiteering," as

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πŸ‘€︎ u/mbrowning00
πŸ“…︎ Oct 20 2020
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Plot progression and Narrative Structure in The Rise of Skywalker is like a gift that keeps on giving...

...but the plot twist is that no one wants the "gift."

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πŸ‘€︎ u/SWPrequelFan81566
πŸ“…︎ Dec 20 2020
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Narrative Structure

Just to clarify, this is a spitball of an idea.

I have been struggling to come up with a good narrative structure for a fantasy idea of mine. It takes place in a world inspired by late Medieval Europe with some Renaissance elements in it. There is also inspiratio from Feudal Japan’s Sengoku Jidai and my catalyst war’s inspiration, the Onin War.

Here’s a brief summary- A supposed curse lies upon the imperial throne and has become a political tool for the Grand Ducal Electors to use when electing the next short lived imperial dynasty. If a lord refuses, he is deemed an enemy of the state and the Electors will form a coagulation against that lord. Seven have sat on the throne thus far and those house’s imperial lines have all ended tragically. It’s been about 250 years since the Empire’s formation after the tumultuous Age of Petty Kings. The current House of Castyrn has sat on the throne for a respectable thirty years. However, the house is slowly dying and the Grand Dukes have become far too powerful. The current emperor has no passion for the position and plans to abdicate to his younger brother who is lord of the family’s ancestral holdings. The Emperor unexpectedly has a son, however, and a powerful house pledges its sword to the son’s succession. That house’s rival pledges its sword in favor of the brother. The emperor’s youngest brother who has been training to become a Vilocop (Priest in my World) turns away from his studies and gains the pledge of another powerful house. A war ensues that is mostly fought in the streets of the capital city, Reiksburg. The city is destroyed and House Castyrn, like the other seven houses, essentially is destroyed. The capital is now in ruins and the imperial throne is even more irrelevant and powerless that it already was. What comes next is an age that I am currently calling the Age of the Warring Houses. The over mighty dukes fight for their personal expansion and glory while obscure houses and vassals begin to rise and make names for themselves.

Now, it’s ambitious. I want the story to span decades. I want to tell the story of the β€œNew Power” as it rises to replace the once mighty houses of the β€œOld Power.” The problem with this is that there are many houses and plots that may be going.

My main problem is structuring the narrative. My spitball idea is to, instead of having regular POV or ordinary chapters, to have the chapters with the surname of the house represented at the beginning of a

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πŸ‘€︎ u/Shamrock2219
πŸ“…︎ Sep 14 2020
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Regarding the role of the 4-act narrative structure in JRPGs

Lately I have been interested in what separates a JRPG from a WRPG (Western RPG). After reading a few articles, a reoccurring point seems to be that JRPGs (and Japanese games in general) follow a 4-act narrative structure, as opposed to a 3 (or 5) act structure in WRPGs. I highly recommend watching the following video about Mario (of all things) to better understand what I mean.

In practice, the latter is the basic (1) Setup -> (2) Confrontation (relies on conflict) -> (3) Resolution - structure we find in games such as The Elder Scrolls or Dragon Age.

On the other hand we have the "Kishōtenketsu", where:

(1) Ki - introduction: a scene is set (prologue/tutorial level)

(2) Shō - development: the story moves forward and flushes out.

(3) Ten - twist: something unexpected happens, mostly outside of the first two parts. May involve a conflict or not.

(4) Ketsu - conclusion: connects the third act to the first two.

The main difference between the two seems to be the first's reliance on conflict as a way to change the status-quo, as opposed to the latter's use of twists such as a conflict as a way to return things to the original status-quo. To quote the relevant parts from an "Art of Narrative" article:

Main Difference:

"The plot of a Kishōtenketsu story relies on the third act twist. This is what puts the whole narrative into context. A traditional Western story starts by introducing conflict and builds to a climax. In Kishōtenketsu, the story is mostly set up that builds towards the story’s major twist."

How Western narrative works:

"While other story models like the Hero’s Journey, or the Seven Point structure are more complex, they work off the same principle. Some form of conflict will disrupt a character’s life and they will work to overcome that conflict. At the heart of all these Western story structures is conflict, and usually, growth."

How Eastern narrative works:

"So, how do you conclude a story with no conflict? Well, in the Ketsu portion of the four-act story you can return the characters to where they were before. The twist may create an unresolved tension in the place of a resolved conflict. This is what makes the story interesting to the reader... Truthfully, we don’t need conflict, or character growth, to make a narrative interesting or worthy. This lack of resolution makes Kishōtenketsu stories appealing in an important way. They are true to life."

[Source](https://ar

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πŸ‘€︎ u/Mad_Maxi
πŸ“…︎ Aug 04 2020
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Part 2 narrative structure destroyed in 5 minutes by Michael Hauge youtu.be/RGYHGc0pTeI
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πŸ‘€︎ u/Britten_One
πŸ“…︎ Jul 23 2020
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