Choline Puns

I checked the nutrition facts and it says one egg yolk contains 20% of daily choline. So if I'm consuming 240% a day, is that gonna do me any harm long term? Some health sites online say that there are risks with overdoing it, but I don't know if that's just SAD diet/medical industry BS or what. Thanks!

I'm curious what things most people may be deficient in that is something that you would deem crucial for optimal brain function and health? Aside from adequate levels of essential fatty acids and choline.

I'm thinking of trying Piracetam and I've read that it's a good idea to supplement Choline alongside Piracetam. I eat 6 eggs for breakfast every morning. Is that comparable to let's say taking Alpha GPC alongside the Piracetam? Thanks!

is uridine necessary if taking cdp choline as it converts into uridine anyway? asking for mr happy stack

I’m having trouble with MTHFR and not doing well w/ B vitamins. There’s a write up on this sub (& varied recommendations out there) to take phosphatidylcholine or creatine to free up methyl groups (I’m botching the reasoning, my brain is tired).

Anyone here ever try this?

Hi all- I just took 250mg of CDP choline a few hours ago and I feel super speedy/ hyper. Has anyone experienced this? Is there an adjustment period or rationale?

I have a hx of concussion so my nervous system is wack which is prob a contributing factor.

This feeling is not sustainable so I’m wondering if I should keep supping so my body can adjust or call it quits. I like the idea of being clearer and more energized which is definitely happening but this is too fast!

Thanks for any info!

I'm tying myself up in knots trying to start supplementing choline.

A week or two ago, there was a post in r/Nootropics which linked Alpha-GPC usage to long-term increased risk of stroke.

Supplementing with soya or sunflower lecithin is pretty unviable, because the choline content of phosphatidylcholine is only around 13%. I don't fancy swallowing a few grams of the stuff every morning.

So I arrive at CDP. My main aim is to simply supplement enough choline because I am a veggie and racetam user. But I also like the alledged cognitive benefits.

But this thing has a three-day half-life! What the hell! I've read enough about excess choline and depressive feelings.

So I'm trying to work out how much mg. of CDP-choline I would need to take per day to consistently supplement around 250mg of choline.

There are a lot of moving parts here: we need to take into account that the choline content of CDP is 18.5%, we need to know the half-life of choline (3 days), and we need to be good at maths. Unfortunately, I am not good at maths.

Also, do I need to be wary of taking too much of other compounds in CDP choline, considering its long half life?

Thanks!

https://mdpi-res.com/d_attachment/nutrients/nutrients-14-00364/article_deploy/nutrients-14-00364.pdf

Prenatal Folate and Choline Levels and Brain and Cognitive Development in Children: A Critical Narrative Review

Nathalie Irvine 1, Gillian England-Mason 2,3, Catherine J. Field 4, Deborah Dewey 2,3,5,6,† and Fariba Aghajafari 6,7,*,† Citation: Irvine, N.; England-Mason, G.; Field, C.J.; Dewey, D.; Aghajafari, F. Prenatal Folate and Choline Levels and Brain and Cognitive Development in Children: A Critical Narrative Review. Nutrients 2022, 14, 364. https://doi.org/10.3390/nu14020364 Academic Editor: Tim Green Received: 14 December 2021 Accepted: 13 January 2022 Published: 15 January 2022 Publisher’s Note: MDPI stays neu- tral with regard to jurisdictional claims in published maps and institu- tional affiliations. Copyright: © 2022 by the authors. Li- censee MDPI, Basel, Switzerland. This article is an open access article distributed under the terms and con- ditions of the Creative Commons At- tribution (CC BY) license (http://crea- tivecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/). 1 O’Brien Centre for the Bachelor of Health Sciences, Cumming School of Medicine, University of Calgary, 3330 Hospital Drive NW, Calgary, AB T2N 4N1, Canada; nathalie.irvine1@ucalgary.ca 2 Owerko Centre, Alberta Children’s Hospital Research Institute, University of Calgary, 2500 University Drive NW, Calgary, AB T2N 1N4, Canada; gillian.englandmason@ucalgary.ca (G.E.-M.); dmdewey@ucalgary.ca (D.D.) 3 Department of Pediatrics, Alberta Children’s Hospital, 28 Oki Drive NW, Calgary, AB T3B 6A8, Canada 4 Department of Agricultural, Food and Nutritional Science, University of Alberta, 4-126C Li Ka Shing Centre for Research, 11203-87th Ave NW, Edmonton, AB T6G 2H5, Canada; catherine.field@ualberta.ca 5 Hotchkiss Brain Institute, Health Research Innovation Centre, Cumming School of Medicine, University of Calgary, 3330 Hospital Drive NW, Calgary, AB T2N 4N1, Canada 6 Department of Community Health Sciences, Cumming School of Medicine, University of Calgary, 3D10, 3280 Hospital Drive NW, Calgary, AB T2N 4Z6, Canada 7 Department of Family Medicine, Cumming School of Medicine, University of Calgary, G012, 3330 Hospital Drive NW, Calgary, AB T2N 4N1, Canada

• Correspondence: fariba.aghajafari@ucalgary.ca † These authors contributed equally to this work.

Abstract: Women’s nutritional status during pregnancy can have long-term effects on children’s brains and cognitive development. Folate and choline

Is taking too much choline during third trimester harmful? I realized my prenatal had choline in it but there’s also lots of food I have daily that contain choline so I am wondering if having too much can cause any defects?

I’m thinking of buying Pramiracetam along with Aniracetam and I was wondering which of the two choline sources listed were better/more efficient. I read someone say before that cdp choline felt more mentally stimulating and alpha gpc felt more physically stimulating but I’d like more opinions. thanks.

Hi,

a neurologist prescribed piracetam to improve my memory - 1.2 g twice a day.

I have a question - what dose of choline to add to this and what source will be okay? I know there is Alcar, Alpha-GPC, Choline Bitinate, but I want to focus on one - and which one do you think will be the best?

I also read that Piracetam is an adenosine inhibitor (?) - Is there a contraindication to using it with cordyceps?

And the last question - how does piracetam relate to the use of psychedelics such as LSD or mushrooms?

Regards

Hi people ! I have started taking pharma grade piracetam 1200 mg 2x a day (with my psychiatrist recomendation, it can be actually prescribed in Poland where I live) as well as choline 300 mg x1 a day. Today is the 14th day of taking it and I have very mixed feelings:

• Initial light memory and focus boost, mild improvement of my ADD symptoms- I could share attention into more tasks a bit more
• Massive headache three days ago but I also have migraines from a time to time so I am not sure if piracetam is to blame
• Despite taking my RX medication before bed time, I have trouble in falling asleep
• Initial memory and focus boost seems to went down in second week- any idea why ?

Another thread about cartinine and choline being converted into TMAO. So far ive seen:

• garlic helps, but also might not
• resveratrol(which i take) and some other plant phenols help
• Vitamin D?
• ??

Any other developments anyone know of? The reason i am concerned is it smells like a fresh sea-food market when i go to the toilet, despite taking resveratrol. I take 300 MG APC and 2g ALCAR daily.

I remember this as a classic (well, it was really popular 3 or 4 years ago) and just took the old dose. I'm enjoying it and may go out for a cigar and watch the stars. Like in the good old days.

Has this combination been overruled? Honestly I haven't used Noopept for a while and choline only as a supplement.

I use phenibut lightly but regularly and don't get heavy into stacks/combos.

Does anyone still use this stack for recreational purposes? Has something else become the better standard for using phenibut in a nootropic stack?

Just curious.

hey guys thanks for helping, here is what i think i need to add:

Choline of some form (Alpha GPC?) DHA Vitamin D Vitamin C

& here is my mockup for a stack - i included stuff ive tried at the bottom (under NOLONGER) but everything above in AM/PM is stuff i want to keep going with or testing out

Hey! So I have tried a few different choline sources over the past few months, taking each individually (on separate days) for about 3-7 days. These include CDP choline - 250 mg, took 500 mg a couple times, phosphatidylcholine - about 1-2 teaspoons of liquid, and eggs - 6 eggs with breakfast. All consumed in the AM.

With all the above, I definitely feel a cognitive and even mood boost after taking, but each day that goes by that I continue to take, I continually feel more run down physically, almost as if I am not getting enough quality sleep. I am not sure if it is as simple as the choline is affecting the quality of my sleep, even though I feel I am sleeping about the same, or if there is something else going on I may be missing.

I would love to continue to consume some type of choline source in my diet due to the numerous health benefits and cognitive benefits that I actually feel, at a minimum just eggs, but can't seem to figure out what is going on? Can anyone share similar experiences or shed some light and/or tips on what may be going on? Thanks!

I just started taking PhenylP orally at 100 mg while I wait to get prescriptions for ADHD. I've gotten 0 effect from it despite trying taking 100 mg in a fasted state, I've tried taking 200 up to 500 mg at once to try to feel something, I've tried taking it up to 7 days in a row, etc. Feeling defeated about how I don't respond well.

People on here told me it's perfectly fine to take without any choline supplements (or eggs) because PhenylP is one of the stronger ones... but maybe a choline supplement like Alpha GPC is what I'm missing? I understand racetams use choline to work, but I assumed I would at least have at least some stimulus from PhenylP without choline supplements. Are you not supposed to feel any effect from racetams if you have no choline?

Or should I try other nootropics? I'm looking at Piracetam especially due to how well it's supposed to pair with PhenylP? Thoughts?

As I understand it, huperzine a supposedly improves memory and cognition by preventing/slowing the breaking down of choline/acetylcholine in the brain. I am looking to improve memory and cognition, but there are some side affects of huperzine a, most notably slowed heart rate, that make me hesitant to try it. Might I gain a similar benefit from just supplementing with choline/acetylcholine?

Are any of y’all that are still recovering from covid taking these two supplements? I know I’ve seen some who have taken them and seen success. I just don’t want to spend $60 and not see results as this has already happened with some of the other things I’ve bought.

A high fat containing chicken egg-only diet suppresses fatty liver induced by a lipid-rich methionine and choline deficient diet

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.06.14.151316v1

Ken-ichi Isobe, Naomi Nishio, Ami Kuzuya, Kana Kato, Aki Hatanaka, Rena Suzuki, Miki Kawai, Aoi Kanjya, Chiaki Suitou, Yui Nakano, Manae Nagasaki doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.06.14.151316 This article is a preprint and has not been certified by peer review [what does this mean?]. 0000032 AbstractFull TextInfo/HistoryMetrics Preview PDF Abstract

Nonalcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD) is a simple hepatic steatosis, which may proceed to nonalcoholic steatohepatitis (NASH) in the presence of steatosis and inflammation with hepatocyte injury. Obesity induced by a high-fat diet or high monosaccharide diet is considered a risk factor for NAFLD. A popular mouse model of NAFLD is a high-fat diet consisting of 60% energy from fat. A modified methionine and choline deficient (MCD) diet containing 60% energy from fat (CDAHFD) is a quick induction model for NAFLD. Chicken eggs also contain 60% energy from fat with very low carbohydrate. Here we compared liver pathologies in mice fed either a CDAHFD or egg-only diet. We found that a CDAHFD induced NAFLD within only two weeks.

Ballooning of hepatocytes with an of immune cell appearance in the liver and high serum ALT and AST indicated that the mice fed CDAHFD developed NAFLD, which could proceed to NASH. However, mice fed an egg-only diet did not develop NAFLD even after 7 weeks. These mice showed normal liver histology with normal ALT and AST. The mice fed an egg-only diet showed high blood ketone bodies and normal blood glucose. Furthermore we found that the mice fed a combination CDAHFD /egg diet or mice fed an egg-only diet after two weeks of CDAHFD diet showed almost normal ALT and AST with reduced levels of fat bodies in the liver. These results indicate that an egg-only diet strongly inhibits high fat and carbohydrates induced NAFLD

I deff feel the benefit of supplements like Huperzine A and Choline, which help boost my dopamine levels.

But after a few hours of taking the supplements I feel a little bit headachey and kinda cracked out.

Any tips on how to balance things? I’m taking a very low dose as it is. Maybe some L-Theanine??

Edit: Dosage is 250MG of CDP Choline and 100 MCG of Huperzine A.

4 hours afters dosing I need to take a 15-20 minute power nap to get feeling right again.

I find that TMG puts me in a bad mood, but sam-e + choline seems to work better. Both sam-e and msm feel similar. Combined with either alpha-gpc or lecithin. Some use TMG as a substitute for sam-e, but they feel totally different to me. Has anyone else noticed the difference?

I just commented this on another post but think that it is important enough point to warrant a dedicated post that opens up the discussion.

Prior and following COVID-19 vaccination, I would recommend avoiding choline supplements like Alpha-GPC. Choline forms are often in pre-workout and taken as nootropics to increase production of acetylcholine, a neurotransmitter found in the brain and naturally used by the body to trigger muscle firing. I was taking alpha GPC as a nootropic before and after getting my vaccine and developed blood clot in the superficial venous system of my calf. I can’t say for sure that the choline supplement played a role but i’ll explain the relationship here.

If you look at the literature, choline supplements have been found to be digested in the gut to produce large amounts of trimethylamine (TMA) which enters blood stream and travels to the liver where it is converted to trimethylamine-N-oxide (TMAO). TMAO then circulates in the blood stream before being excreted. High serum levels of TMAO are linked to cardiovascular disease and chronic kidney disease. High levels of TMAO originating from gut was found to directly contribute to platelet hyperreactivity and enhanced thrombosis (blood clot) potential. Plasma TMAO levels in subjects (n > 4,000) independently predicted incident (3 years) thrombosis (heart attack, stroke) risk. The results are really staggering, look at the figures of study two below, high levels of TMAO really increases blood clotting exponentially.

The major complication reported from the vaccine is blood clot related. Out of an abundance of caution and with the relationship above considered, I would seriously avoid supplementing choline pre and post vaccination. I don’t have any recommendation for duration of abstinence but imagine that a month pre and post would be sufficient and certainly better than not stopping at all.

Hope this was helpful :) please let me know what you think and stay safe!

Sources:

1. ⁠https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7468957/#idm140127301115296title
2. ⁠https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4862743/

I was listening to the Huberman Podcast and he mentioned choline being a supplement used as a Nootropic for increased cognitive function.

So, I decided I'd try it out and bought some Alpha GPC containing Choline and Uridine. But I decided to research it a bit further and found some topics on Reddit where they were talking about how it can increase risk of heart attack/stroke (because of making blood "stickier" and at increased risk of clotting) and that it was also tied to cancer formation as it can "feed" cancer cells.

Before I freak out and return the product, I'd like to gather more input and see if anyone here has familiarity with these studies or first hand experience with choline supplementation. Is there any actual risk of the above or are these studies scare mongering tactics? Does it actually seem to work for those who take it in terms of cognitive performance?

Thanks!

I am looking for a good non-stimulant pre-workout, and have been looking in particular at the Transparent Labs Stim-free. The ingredient list is pretty great (all of the compounds seem to be safe, and it even uses stevia instead of Ace-K or sucralose for a sweetener), but it includes 500mg of Choline Bitartrate and 50mcg of Huperzine A, which based on the research I've done is also cholinergic.

I have read on this subreddit that too much choline can cause depression and anhedonia, which I struggle with as-is and I don't want to make those issues worse. Are these dosages that I should be worried about excessive choline? What would be the first symptoms to look for if I do have excessive choline? I would like to use this pre-workout 4 times per week.

I’m think of using it as a source of choline for Noopept.