I had never read this talk before. Since when do the prophets get to bypass the plan of salvation with this crap? Under this doctrine, an apostle could totally exercise a "Hall Pass" weekend in Vegas with his buddies from the quorum, filled with women, booze, Starbucks, and top the night by starring in a pornographic film called "Mormons Gone Wild" (victory for Satan), and the Lord is cool with it. No repentance required. Meanwhile, Bishops are asking 16-year-old girls if they touch themselves too long while bathing, and calling them to repentance.

Accepted of the Lord: The Doctrine of Making Your Calling and Election Sure

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1976/07/accepted-of-the-lord-the-doctrine-of-making-your-calling-and-election-sure?lang=eng

I recently brought up the Second Anointing to some LDS family members and at first they didn't seem to believe that it's a real thing. I tried to give some references off the top of my head like the lesson manual that cautions people against talking about it, and I got the vibe that they didn't care. One even directly said she didn't really care.

I can't imagine being told that your church performs a temple ordinance you didn't know about where you are anointed a King/Queen and not caring about it? I definitely cared about it as a member. I thought it was really deep and cool. One of the "mysteries of the kingdom."

Did any of you care about it? What did you first hear about it, and what were your thoughts at the time? Good or bad?

As a TBM, I knew that the apostles and prophets were special witnesses of Christ. As all the apostles in New Testament times had seen Christ, walked with him or saw him in vision, certainly our apostles and prophets have all likewise seen him.

I had heard about the second anointing, or having your calling and election made sure, and I was pretty sure those people all saw Christ as well. Tonight I was looking through church teachings on that matter, and I couldn't find anything related to that at all about seeing Christ. Finally I stumbled across this teaching of Joseph Smith, which the church seems to leave out when talking about it:

“After a person has faith in Christ, repents of his sins, and is baptized for the remission of his sins and receives the Holy Ghost, (by the laying on of hands), which is the first Comforter, then let him continue to humble himself before God, hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and living by every word of God, and the Lord will soon say unto him, Son, thou shalt be exalted. When the Lord has thoroughly proved him, and finds that the man is determined to serve Him at all hazards, then the man will find his calling and his election made sure. then it will be his privilege to receive the other Comforter, which the Lord hath promised the Saints, as is recorded in the testimony of St. John.”

“When any man obtains this last Comforter, he will have the personage of Jesus Christ to attend him, or appear unto him from time to time, and even He will manifest the Father unto him”
Joseph Smith (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith,149–51).

And then you have Elder Oaks telling a youth fireside that neither he nor other members of the Q15 have seen Christ or had any kind of divine visitation or vision. Like, that's like the entire point of their calling, to see Christ and be a special witness of him! Maybe they just don't have enough faith, or maybe they're just not righteous enough. Maybe if they just tried harder, they'd be worthy of receiving the divine support of their calling. Or, maybe it's just all made up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrMJ2YZD62M&t=12s&ab_channel=ThinkerOfThoughts

On a Mormonism Live ! episode that streamed today, Bill Reel asked Radio Free Mormon if he's had the Second Anointing. RFM's response was:

>I cannot confirm or deny whether I have received the second anointing and that's all I can say about that, but... but we have been instructed not to share our most spiritual experiences with the world.
>
>I cannot say I have not because... for one reason and I cannot say I have for another reason.

And then:

>No, I doubt that there is any truth to that rumor.

So, initially my thinking was that he couldn't say he hasn't had the second anointing because it would be lying and he couldn't say he has because of a Non-Disclosure Agreement he signed or something.

Then he said the last thing, which makes me think it was just a joke. He has talked in the past about the ways church leaders imply that they have seen God and/or Christ without actually saying it. RFM loves a good joke and this one was so expertly played that it had me wondering if he actually has had his second anointing, just as prophets and apostles had me convinced for years that they had seen and spoken with Jesus Christ.

This did have me wondering though... I wouldn't be surprised if an NDA was a requirement for certain callings or rituals in the church. Is anyone familiar with someone who has recently had a Second Anointing and if there are additional measures put in place to maintain secrecy?

In the most recent episode of the Sunstone Mormon History podcast, Episode 34-Temple Developments Part 3, Lindsay Hansen Park notes that the second anointing is given to all children of the members of the Quorum of 12 apostles along with their spouses. This information comes from the son or son-in-law of a Q12 member, according to Hansen Park.

See the episode at the 32:20 to 32:40 time stamp.

A couple of my thoughts:

• Lindsay and Bryan Buchanan do an awesome job with this podcast

• Lindsay has incredible access and insight to the inner workings of the Brighamite branch and most others

• this policy frustrates me! The clear class distinctions in the church based on who you know and who you are related to are antithetical to so many claimed teachings in the Bible and BoM.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/sunstone-mormon-history-podcast/id1453771312?i=1000510799499

Edit: added link to episode

I was listening to John Dehlin's recent interview with Sandra Tanner and learned she made a photocopy of Hofmann's forgery of a second anointing script. She shared the copy in her and Jerald's book, Tracking the White Salamander. I couldn't find a transcribed version so thought I'd share.

Link to image.

Dear Bro. ___:

Having the authority of God, I pour this holy oil upon your head, and anoint you a King and a priest unto the Most High God to rule and reign in the House of Israel forever.

I bestow upon you all of the rights, blessings, and authorities appertaining unto the Holy Priesthood for the building up of the Kingdom of God on earth.

By virtue of this authority I seal you up unto eternal life wherein nothing but the unpardonable shedding of innocent blood or consenting thereto by denying the Holy Spirit may deprive you of this promise and blessing [sic]. Thou shalt be exalted in the Celestial Kingdom of God and shall dwell with the patriarchal ^^family order of God forever.

With this exaltation I ordain you an equal in the order of the everlasting priesthood with the Gods, and all the holy angels your fellows. Your kingdoms and power and glory shall have no end. Your righteous seed shall be from everlasting to everlasting and shall continually sing praises unto you without end.

All of this I lawfully do, by right of the Holy Priesthood, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.

So I'm pretty sure my grandmother received her 2nd anointing before my grandfather passed away. They worked at the temple for two decades in a non-Utah temple and got very close to the temple presidency and their wives, my grandpa served as high councilman for a very long time and she was a stake RS president multiple times, stuff like that. They were very close to a couple in our stake, the husband was a sp and seventy, and the wife was the daughter of one of the current apostles.

My grandmother acts like she has more faith than anyone else and when I brought up some church history facts she said she'd never heard of them, but that it didn't matter because her faith is so strong that she doesn't need those pesky facts. Only weak saints care about those. She also acts like the atonement doesn't apply to her, like she's already "made it".

I want to call her out really casually and just slip in something the next time I see her that makes her question whether I know what she knows, you know? I want to see her reaction because I know she'd totally give it away if I said it the right way. Any ideas? I thought about saying "We can't all have our calling and election made sure like you" or something like that, but I don't know the wording of the ordinance so I can't really quote anything. Thanks!

Second anointing grants you unconditional salvation. But when a person is excommunicated, his baptism is invalidated. How do we resolve this contradiction?

Or are there an implicit rule that a person who recurved second anointing cannot be excommunicated no matter what he did?

It's a funny mental exercise and hypothetical, but it's technically true.

Dallin Oaks could technically have sex with all the men that he wanted to and he would STILL make it into the top tier of Mormon heaven. His exaltation is assured.

He could even have a relationship with a fellow gay employee of The Corporation of The President, and it wouldn't matter......only committing murder of an innocent or denying the Holy Ghost would prevent him from being automatically resurrected as a Mormon God.

Correct us if we are wrong about the Second anointing.....

The More you know....

Can't take a joke, little Dallin?

.

❗ [HOW TO GET AWAY WITH RAPE/MURDER/RUNNING TRAFFIC LIGHTS AND STILL GO TO MORMON HEAVEN] ❗

AKA "Your Get Out of Hell Free Card": The Second Anointing

...

Imagine a church teaching so secret, so sacred, and so taboo to talk about that most members don't even realize it exists.

That's right, today I wanted to talk about my favorite part of Mormon church history, The Second Anointing.

...

What is the second anointing?

Well, put simply, it's when an apostle in the church invites you on a Sunday to a local church temple for you and your spouse to wash one another's feet (like Jesus) and then lay hands on one another and pronounce "blessings by the Holy Spirit".

It's not much...

Except for...oh that's right! You're also anointed Kings and Queens and Priests and Priestesses to rule and reign in the House of Israel forever.

AND you're guaranteed a seat at the right hand of Jesus NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO IN THIS LIFE.

Oh, and you're give the power of gods.

That's probably important to points out too.

Essentially it's the golden ticket.

Rape?

Murder?

Enjoying listening to Weezer?

There's no need for forgiveness anymore because you're already pronounced "clean from the blood and sins of this generation".

...

Why haven't most members of the church ever heard of this teaching though?

Well, because you're not allowed to talk about it.

The ONLY reference you'll find in any current church manual is this:

"Exercise caution while discussing the doctrine of having our calling and election made sure. Avoid speculation. Use only the sources given here and in the student manual. Do not attempt in any way to discuss or answer questions about the second anointing."

Ahhh, there's that famous Mormon phraseology that's so common:

Avoid other sources.

Oh, and don't talk about it.

Classic Mormonism.

...

Why not discuss it though?

Because it's like casting pearls before swine (to use the scriptural phrase)?

Because ordaining men and women as gods seems a little too intense?

To be blessed to live as long as you would like seems a bit absurd?

Or, maybe because usually the only people who receive the Second Anointing are those who have contributed massive fortunes of money or inordinate decades of their life serving church leaders?

(I'm guess it's probably that last one 😉)

...

You see, the thing about the Second Anointing within Mormonism is that it invalidates the need for Jesus anymore.

You're guaranteed forgiveness for anything and everything because

Can someone please explain the second anointing to me? I left the church about a year ago and since then I have been trying to do a ton of research from everything I was shielded from, and I still can’t find anything about that?

On TikTok (I know, lame) NewNameNoah expresses open interest at attempting to film the Second Anointing. I know he likes to just tease and troll, but I also know I’m sure he’s thought of it.

So, how in the world would you imagine this being possible? How would you do it? Do you know someone? Etc.

Always been a little daydream of mine lol

i know that almost every successful Mormon believes he or she is special, but just how widespread is the official ceremony? Thanks.

There is an elder couple in my ward — of lengthy church pedigrees and eager to discuss their many missions and much righteousness — who am I fairly sure has had their second anointing.

The guy was just selected as EQ president.

In preparation for an inevitable meeting with this guy, what might I say that would get under his skin while providing plausible naivety on my part. I just want to play this little game.

Please no over the top suggestions, I’d like to have some real options that have the veneer of naivety and sincerity but are likely to really annoy him if he has had the 2nd announcing.

Could someone please share why they are so concerned with the second anointing? I've read through the Wiki article, not much else, and maybe I'm just missing something but it doesn't seem as outlandish to me as some of you lovely people think it is. I'd love a better understanding but from my limited reading it seems pretty middle of the pack amongst alot of the other Mormon beliefs.

It sounds like a good old boys club to me, giving leaders who have had it, an excuse for bad behavior, and showing who is church broke. It also reeks of nepotism and pride. It also appears to undermine the atonement of Jesus Christ. Also interested in faithful responses too.

I understand it just doesn't have that much to do with anyone, and that most of us will never be directly affected by it, is that why?

I would guess that it's just not necessary to know about and there are more helpful things to spend our time discussing. But it seems like many members haven't even heard of it.

Edit: here's the wiki link on it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_anointing

The church hasn’t talked about the second anointing for decades. I didn’t see anything in the handbook. Why the secrecy? I believe >95% of members have no idea it exists. Do you think that’s true?

It broke my heart to realize that she has spent her life subject to general authorities and supposedly more spiritual people and that she believes she will continue to be subject to those people for eternity. She posts regularly on Facebook about loving America and freedom and patriotism, but she has spent her life in a totalitarian church that makes feel guilty for her secret love of chai tea. It makes me soooo angry to think my family is subject to guys in red chairs.

Ephesians 2:8-9 New International Version (NIV)

8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

I’m listening to the Mormon Stories interview with Lila Tueller and they are talking about the 2nd Anointing and how you are forgiven of all you sins past and future.

In one sense, that would be a huge weight lifted off your shoulders to be told that all your sins are forgiven and that you will never sin again. All the guilt from that one sin you forgot to confess is gone. All the shame from sins you couldn’t stop. Plus, in the future, you don’t need to worry about accidentally swearing or having a bad thought because you are guaranteed the celestial kingdom. All you need to worry about is serving the church. It would be a huge relief and would remove tons of shame and guilt.

However, the alternate side which the interview gets into, is worse. If you can’t sin anymore, that means whatever you do is right. It’s not that sin is canceled out for you, it means everything you think and say and do is called of god because you don’t sin. You are now gods mouthpiece.

So when Oaks gives the hurtful, homophobic talks, he is saying what he honestly believes, to his core, without a shadow of a doubt, is from god. He really thinks every word which comes out of his mouth is the word of god. He thinks he is right and everyone else is wrong. Why else would god choose him for the second anointing?

Some similarities in the two organizations (especially when JS and BY were president but other presidents fit as well) and achieving either status gives the person position and power far beyond regular members, especially with the top leadership. Also, both require that one gives all that you have, even your life if necessary to the building of the organization.

I’m familiar with the ceremony from the account of Hans Mattson, I’m more interested in info on what the second anointing does. There seems to be some dispute. Does it mean you’re in the celestial kingdom? You can sin all you want and it doesn’t matter? Not sure if this is laid out clearly anywhere in written form.

If you believe that you are already assured of your salvation, than what is your incentive to be a good person ?

Initially I think you would get average $100,000 per week for say 150 temples (some are under renovation) 50 weeks a year. 3/4 of a billion! The rich who have been passed over for higher callings can finally get theirs. Revenue might drop off after a while though. The church still gets the money they so love. Everyone wins!

https://youtu.be/XwPfiNGzwSU

58:10

Who started this rumor anyway?