I keep noticing Greeks who seem to "harden" the way they pronounce 'μι' relative to what seems to be "standard" (unmarked) pronunciation.

In other words, a word like νομίζω is typically pronounced like /noˈmi.zo/. And the tendency I observe is for people (who exhibit this feature) to pronounce it as /noˈmɨ.zo/, with the /i/ vowel pulled back to the position of a "close/high central unrounded vowel" /ɨ/.

Is this some kind of localized feature or accent (i.e. of Athenian speakers)? Or is it a trend among young people? I seem to hear it most frequently from younger people and, especially, Greek rappers.

Here's a clear example of it from a singer/rapper named Semeli (at the 1:28 mark of a Live Session), where she says, "Θα ξεκινήσω με κάτι που νομίζω..."

*As an aside (for anyone who might be familiar with Russian), this is very similar to the difference between the "soft" palatalized Russian consonant "ми" [mʲi] and the "hard" palatalized Russian consonant in "мы" [mɨ].

Seems like all of these are rare, but why?

They are so rare that Wikipedia only lists one or two languages with /ɶ/ while there isn’t even an article on /ɒ̈/. Meanwhile, /ɒ/ seems to be present in a larger segment of languages.

What makes the rounded “A” vowels so rare?

Apparently, /ʕ̞/ is the semivowel equivalent of the open back unrounded vowel /ɑ/, so what would the semivowel equivalent be for the open central unrounded vowel /ä/? And I assume there is no semivocal equivalent for the open front unrounded vowel /a/?

I was trying to make a vowel harmony system in my conlang that extended over the entire word, so I went to the Lexurgy Wiki, and I copied the long range vowel harmony rule that uses the propagate function to harmonize the entire word, rather than one set of vowels.

vowel-harmony [vowel] propagate:
    [!central] => [$frontness] / [!central $frontness] _

Unfortunately, this wasn't working the way I intended, and a lot of my words werent harmonic. I asked u/Meamoria for help, and he sent back a working rule:

vowel-harmony [vowel] propagate:
    [!central] => [$frontness] / [!central $frontness] [central]* _

by making [central] option in the environment argument with the * function, the harmony is no longer interrupted by central vowels. Hope this helps anyone else stuck!

A friend pointed out I said the words "boat" and "bow" strangely and I noticed that I did, and I haven't stopped noticing it with people who live near me, but I don't notice it when I'm in Southern California or Northern California. I live in the Central Coast. I've only really heard it in my area and some other rural parts. I can't find anything that sounds about right for this. I've spent a good amount of time just trying to find out what diphthong or what vowel sound this is but I just can't.

verbal example

/e/ is the mid vowel between /i/ and /a/ while /o/ is the mid vowel between /u/ and /a/. /e/ and /o/ are very common. Yet the vowel /ɨ/ which is the mid vowel between /i/ and /u/ is very rare. Why is that?

(In other words, the cardinal vowels /a/, /i/, /u/ are extremely common and so are 2 of the 3 mid point vowels between them: /e/ and /o/. Yet the 3rd mid point vowel /ɨ/ is very rare.)

It is not listed on the https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_phonology page but I can hear some sort of central unstressed vowel in speech. Does Persian have a central vowel or my ears aren't working properly?

I was just reading wikipedia article about lithuanian (my native language) phonology. And it's just written there that > /ɐ, aː/ are phonetically central [ɐ, äː]. Phonologically, they behave like back vowels.

What does that mean?

In New Zealand we have merged KIT with schwa to [ɘ]. Does this make NZ English the only accent of English that doesn't have schwa as a phoneme? For example every vowel in "invisibleness" is KIT. Note that Our commA vowel is in free variation between KIT [ɘ] and STRUT [ɐ] (though the plural is always KIT).

Follow-up, if KIT were to migrate somewhere (bringing old-schwa along with it), would NZ English re-innovate a schwa, since it seems to central to English? How would it do so then?

Hello everyone. I've been working on this (still unnamed) conlang and its descendants on and off for the past year or so, with the intention of making them as naturalistic as possible. I decided now was as good a time as any to take a break from working on syntax and reflect on/share a bit of what I've actually built so far, and also maybe to get some feedback. So, I figured I'd start by sharing the ur-language's phonology as it stands currently, as well as related aspects like phonotactics and the romanization system. Anyway, here you go, and feel free to comment/criticize/whatever if anything jumps out to you. Thanks!

Phonology

So I based the phonology (at least the consonants) somewhat on the Athabaskan family and Quechua. I knew I wanted to develop tone later on down the line, so a lot of my choices were informed by that. The vowel system takes some cues from (Vietnamese is a good example, but there are others which are probably a bit closer to what we have here).

Consonants

Some notes here:

1. All non-nasals and non-glides are devoiced word finally. Word final /l/ is realized as [ɬ]. Some dialects also devoice the glides, which are usually realized as voiceless fricatives in this environment.

2. All consonants geminate after stressed "light" vowels (more on what that is later) which do not have a phonemic coda consonant. Geminated ejective and aspirated stops are realized as a voiceless-ejective or voiceless-aspirate stop sequence. /ɾ:/ is realized as [r].

3. All aspirated stops are realized as pre-aspirates post-vocalically, unless they are geminated by the previous rule.

4. Voiceless stops are voiced between voiced phonemes including vowels, unless geminated by rule (2).

Also, I know affricates aren't technically stops, but they behave as stops here and in many natural languages so I put them in the same rows as the stops, whatever.

Vowels

Ok, monophthongs:

and diphthongs:

Not all that much to say here

If you were a native speaker of your conlang then how will you spell english (or your actual native if you'ren't native english speaker) words, what accent will you have?

My conlanglang, emperatorın, is characterized by the fact that all letters are read exactly as they are spelled and if we look at latin alphabet (which english uses) they don't see the difference between x & s, v & w, q & k

So in this case phrase "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" will be pronunced as "t-heh koo-ee-c-k broh-v-n foh-s yoom-p-(y)s oh-vehr lah-zy dohg" (where: c is alveolar stop as in slavic langs (yes we pronunce it like stop, not affricate); y is central vowel; r is trill; (y) means that syllabe is too long and needs prostetic schwa)

But Emperator people aren't stupid, they're aware of digraphs, yet "th" and "dh" sounds like "s͡f" and "z͡v". And since there's no alveloar approximant in emperatorın, english "r" would sound to them as /w/ or /l/ (sometimes) or /r/ (in american "better"). But what will sound to them as /r/ is american <tt> and <dd>

Also, since emperatorın only has 6 vowels - they only recognize 6 vowel sounds. I mean most of the time it's pretty straight forward, the only problem is with the schwa, since it's pronunciation in english sometimes sounds more like "eh", st more like "ah", st more like "oh" and sometimes more like "uh"

They also doesn't recognize stress, tone and vowel lenght (exept in their native words and only in singular-plural pair, which means sin is always short and pl is always long)

So, as a recap english sounds and their approximations in emperatorın:

b, f, g, j, k, m, n, p, s, v, z - just like in ipaŋ - since ng is forbidden in coda, the pronunciation will be /n(ə) gə/ or just /n/also their native usage of ŋ is for nasal vowels, so for eg. touching will be /t̪aʧ̝ĩ/t, d - dental consonantsʧ, ʤ, ʃ, ʒ - pretty much like in english but between post alveolar and retroflexθ, ð - that've been said beforeh - xl - ɫr - that've been said before

"e-coloured" vowels are : /e/, /ɛ/, /ə/, /æ/ are all pronunced as /ɛ/ but /ə/ can be sometimes pronunced as /ɛa/ and /æ/ as /aɛ/
"a-coloured" vowels are: /a/, /ʌ/, /ɑ/ are all pronunced as /a/ but the last one can be pronunced as /aɔ/
"i-coloured" vowels is /i/
"u-coloured" vowels are: /u/, /ʊ/ are pronunced as /u͍/ (unrounded lips, rounded tongue)
"o-coloured" vowels are: /ɔ/, /ɑ/, /o/ are pronunced as /ɔ͍/ (unrounded lips, rounded t

Zieth (Zieth: Þe Zeeþ Spraake [θɛ zeːθ ˈspɹɑːkə] or just Zeeþ [zeːθ]) is a Germanic language spoken in Ziethland, a Oculo-AlloGeo country. I based Zieth on mainly Germanic languages such as Dutch, Afrikaans, West Frisian, and some English. Zieth is written with a modified Latin alphabet.

Consonants

• there is no Final-Obstruent-Devoicing, unlike many other Germanic languages

Vowels

Articles

DEFINITE

þe [θɛ] "the"

INDEFINITE

een [eːn] "one/a(n)"

Plural Nouns

Noun + (e)n

hond "dog" > honden "dogs"

Verbs

Verbs usually end in -n

Here is the verb eeten "to eat"

So that's the end! If you have any questions about Zieth, let me know! Bye!

I think that I use k to s before front vowels and sonorant debuccalization between vowels wayyyy too often.

Wiktionary says the syllable しゅ is pronounced [ɕɨᵝ] but I'm pretty sure it should be [ɕɯ] because that's what it sounded like whenever I listened to it from native speakers. Wouldn't [ɕɨᵝ] be closer to し? I'm really confused about that

I've had this idea for a while, and I'm posting it now. I hope I can post this here.

When I compare Moagilic English (MoE) to "regular English", the "regular English" will be General American English (GAmE).

Consonants

• unlike in GAmE, MoE's intervocalic [t d] don't turn into [ɾ]
• GAmE Post-Alveolar consonants are Retroflex in MoE
• [w] ⟨w⟩ and [ʍ] ⟨wh⟩ are differentiated in MoE.

Vowels

Vowel Comparison

Mergers:

• cot-caught: [ɔ]
• father-bother: [ɔ]
• bed-bad: [ɛ]

Example Sentence

"The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog."

GAmE: [ðə ˈkwɪk bɹaʊn ˈfɔks ˈdʒʌmps oʊvəɹ ðə ˈleɪzi dɔg]

MoE: [ðə ˈkwɪk bɹoʊn ˈfɔks ˈɖʐəmps oʊvəɹ ðə ˈleɪzi dɔg]

Let me know if you have any more questions about this! :)

Sèu is meant to be a naturalistic language but I still have some doubts and questions about the current phonology’s naturalism, which I will ask as I explain the phonology itself, questions will be indicated with a quote and sometimes extra info will be added below the question to add more context.

If there’s anything else I didn’t ask about that comes off as unnaturalistic, please tell me about it and how I can change it.

Consonants and Vowels

/ɯ/ is actually more centralised [ɯ̽]

Phonotactics

Syllable Structure: (C)(G)V

G here means the glides, /j/ and /w/, but having this as a slot in the syllable can be disputed as /j/ can only occur if C is a bilabial consonant, and even then it’s often realised as a palatalised consonant rather than a consonant-glide sequence, i.e. /pj/ would actually be [pʲ]. The same goes for /w/, where it’s often realised as labialisation on the preceding consonant, though it cannot occur after palatals.

> Should I just say that the language has palatalised bilabials and labialised consonants and just have the syllable structure as (C)V? Is this type of labialisation even naturalistic to begin with?

> I can’t help but feel iffy about the labialisation. I mainly added it in just cause it sounds nicer to me than a consonant + w sequence, I could just as easily have the obstruents de-voice it and have more /w̥/s if it would ruin my goal of naturalism however.

Only palatals and bilabials can precede /i/, with the bilabials being palatalised.

Primary stress is always on the second syllable of a word, and the first syllable of a word always receives secondary stress.

> Is fixed second syllable stress well attested? I know that WALS has a map on this and some languages do feature it but I’d just like to make sure.

Unaspirated stops, unaspirated affricates and fricatives become voiced when in between two resonants.

/ɯ/ isn’t allowed to proceed bilabial consonants as it rounds to /u/ in said environment, and /ɑ̃/ also undergoes this change, rounding to [ɒ̃] when next to bilabial consonants.

Liaison and Sandhi

When nasal vowels appear word-finally and

Do your worst!

I'm surprised it hasn't decade.

You’ve probably seen something like this on the sub: “Adem/Edema/Adamah is (Hebrew = ‘earth’)” or “Clay = adamah (Hebrew for ‘ground, earth’)” But there’s a lot more to the Hebrew language than that. I want to to flesh out the Hebrew connections that I’ve seen in kkcwhiteboard and to provide a more comprehensive foundation for incorporating Hebrew language connections in KKC content. At the very least, there's some neat linguistic trivia here.

Two Quick Notes:

• I am not a native Hebrew speaker. I studied modern and biblical Hebrew for 9 years, speak Hebrew at my job, and briefly taught elementary school Hebrew.
• As noted by u/taltalim: “I don’t think we can assume that just because one thing derives from Hebrew, that other things derive from Hebrew as well.” So while language, words, and names are central to the story, this is just one lens to view KKC through.

Roots and Vowels - Shorashim and Nekudot

To break down a hebrew word we look at four things, though we’re interested in the first three:

1. Consonants (which together form roots, or "shorashim")
2. Vowels
3. Stress/emphasis
4. & Tense, gender, plurality modifiers

Unlike English where vowels are just a subset of letters alongside consonants, in Hebrew, only a few letters (א, ה, ו, י, ע) carry the open sounds of English vowels. A majority of vowel sounds are represented by non-letter characters called “Nekudot.” So a sequence of consonants AND their vowels/nekudot are what form a word. This is important because a word can essentially be spelled the same way, but its meaning is changed by its vowels… sound familiar?

> “That is my name. Vashet. The Hammer. The Clay. The Spinning Wheel.” She pronounced her name three separate ways, each with its own cadence. “I am that which shapes and sharpens, or destroys.”

(Edit: posting an example that I wrote out in the comments) Here's how the vowels (nekkudot) in a word can change its meaning despite the letters used staying the same.

כתב – (Root word: to write)

• Katav כָּתַב – (He) wrote

• Katav כַּתָּב – A reporter

• K'tav כְּתָב – Script (handwriting, manuscript)

So with that in mind, we can get into Adam/Adom/Adem/Adamah

The root of the word is this set of letters: א, ד, מ – aleph, dalet, and mem – A, D, M. Let’s see how many meanings we can get out of the word just by 'pronouncing' it in separate ways (only by changing the nekudot/vowels).

1. Adam - אָדַם - means “[to be viscous, thick, dark] to be red, grow red.”

Dovlanian (Critanian: Język Dovlanske [jɛ̃zɨk dɔˈvɫanskɛ] or just Dovlanske [dɔˈvɫanskɛ]) is a West Slavic language spoken in Dovlane, a Central European country. I based on mainly West Slavic languages such as Polish and Czech. Like other West Slavic languages, Dovlanian is written in a modified Latin script. Dovlanian's consonant inventory is similar to Polish's, but less so to other Slavic languages', due to unusual features such as nasal consonants.

Consonants

• /mʲ pʲ bʲ fʲ vʲ c ɟ ç tɕ dʑ ɕ ʑ ɲ ʎ/ are allophones of /m p b f v k g x ʈ͡ʂ t d ʂ ʐ n ɫ/ before /i/

Vowels

Stress

Stress in Dovlanian is always on the penultimate syllable.

dzievčonka [dʑɛˈfʈ͡ʂɔnka] "girl"

For monosyllabic words, this obviously does not apply.

Nouns

Nouns in Dovlanian come in 3 genders, masculine, feminine, and neuter.

Here are the inflections for hleb "bread", a masculine noun:

So, that was Dovlanian, if you want to see more about this, let me know! :)

For context I'm a Refuse Driver (Garbage man) & today I was on food waste. After I'd tipped I was checking the wagon for any defects when I spotted a lone pea balanced on the lifts.

I said "hey look, an escaPEA"

No one near me but it didn't half make me laugh for a good hour or so!

Edit: I can't believe how much this has blown up. Thank you everyone I've had a blast reading through the replies 😂

It really does, I swear!