Since we all know that for the melodic minor scale, we play the natural minor form of the scale when we descend, does the same apply when we are playing through the modes of the melodic minor scale?
I'm a beginner and I'm studying scales. Every resource I've seen says the melodic descending minor scale is the same as the natural minor scale (where you have to lower by 1 semitone the 3rd, 6th and 7th notes of the major scale to get it). But then, if it's "exactly the same" as the natural minor, why have a melodic descending minor scale? There must be a difference, for it to have a reason to exist! Thanks in advance!
Edit: I found a video that - in my opinion - amazingly explains how minor scales work, in a very simple way. It really helped me understand the basics so I could then process all of your answers! Here it is in case any of you want to check it out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7WqKpD7w4Q. Do you find it as good as I did? Would you say it's good enough to share it with other people who have the same confusion I had?
I don't think any other scales have this property where the notes change depending whether you are ascending or descending
Hey, this might be kind of a stupid question idk, but I'm finally putting some effort into properly understanding music theory and going back to basics, and I was wondering if there's a reason that in a melodic minor scale the 6th and 7th are raised a half step from the natural minor scale on the ascending scale but not the descending other than it sounding right?
also im interested to know the reason theyre named harmonic and melodic :)
Both are important, but which one needs a little more time and practice in the context of real pieces?
Melodic minor also sometimes doesn't change into the natural minor descending, so is it really worth doing it differently ascending and descending?
[This link explains] (https://music.stackexchange.com/questions/43363/why-do-the-notes-of-melodic-minor-scale-change-when-you-play-it-in-descending-or?utm_medium=organic&utm_source=google_rich_qa&utm_campaign=google_rich_qa) that the difference between going up and going down on the melodic minor is for teaching two types of minor in one, and that there are many reasons why a composer would want a melodic descending scale.
Why are they technically the same scale?
I decided to audition for the All State band this year, and my school bases their concert band audition music on the All State band audition music, so I'm feeling fairly confident about it. The one thing I'm not certain about is memorizing the melodic minor scales, since my school only makes us play the major scales for auditions. I know what scale degrees I need to change to make a major scale into a melodic minor, but when I do that on the fly from memory it isn't as solid as I'd like it to be, especially on the scales that I haven't actually played in as often or at all.
Are there any good strategies for doing this? Any advice would be appreciated.
Kinda new to music theory so I would really appreciate if someone could explain this to me!
Setting aside the tonal center of a particular piece, couldn't any Harmonic Minor scale be thought of as the Aeolian mode of its relative Major Scale with a #5? ... and by extention, wouldn't it follow that A Melodic Minor is merely the Aeolian mode of C Major with a #4 & #5...
Isn't that Lydian Augmented? In other words, does that make Lydian Augmented the relative Major Scale of Melodic Minor? ...and how does this play into George Russell's conceptual theories about the Lydian mode?
Thanks so much!
What is the Melodic Minor Scale?
The Melodic Minor Scale is one of the 3 minor scale patterns, the other two being the natural minor and harmonic minor. A minor scale refers to any heptatonic scale in which the first, third, and fifth scale degrees form a minor triad.
The ascending melodic minor scale can be notated as:
>1, 2, ♭3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
While the descending melodic minor scale is:
>1, 2, ♭3, 4, 5, ♭6, ♭7, 8
Another way to think about the ascending melodic minor scale is as a diatonic major scale with a lowered third, for example, C–D–E♭–F–G–A–B–C.
The scales that result from the modes of the ascending melodic minor scale are essential to jazz improvisation and in this post, I will give you an overview of what these scales are and how you can begin to use them.
What are the Modes of the Melodic Minor Scale?
The seven modes that are obtained from the melodic minor scale are as follows.
^(W = Whole step h = Half Step for more clarification on intervals) ^(click here.)
| Mode | 1-2 | 2-3 | 3-4 | 4-5 | 5-6 | 6-7 | 7-8 |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Melodic Minor | W | h | W | W | W | W | h |
| Dorian b2 | h | W | W | W | W | h | W |
| Lydian Augmented | W | W | W | W | h | W | h |
| Lydian Dominant | W | W | W | h | W | h | W |
| Mixolydian b13 | W | W | h | W | h | W | W |
| Locrian #2 | W | h | W | h | W | W | W |
| Altered | h | W | h | W | W | W | W |
How Can We Actually Use These Modes?
To understand how we can use these modes to create unique sounds, it's important to first understand what chord qualities are associated with each of the modes. Similar to how we associate chord qualities with the scales of the church modes (ii, Dorian, IV, Lydian) to understand what scales fit over what chords, we can begin to create a dynamic, exotic and jazzy melodic/harmonic vocabulary by using the chord qualities associated with each mode of the Melodic Minor Scale.
^(If you are feeling confused by this table, I recommend brushing up on your) ^(chord names.)
| Mode | Associated Chord (in C) | Scale |
|---|---|---|
| Melodic Minor | Cmin6 or C-6 | C–D–E♭–F–G–A–B |
| Dorian b2 | Dsus13b2 | D–E♭–F–G–A–B–C |
| Lydian Augmented | Ebmaj7#5 | E♭–F–G–A–B–C–D |
| Lydian Dominant | F7 (or F9, F7#11) | F–G–A–B–C–D–Eb |
| Mixolydian b13 | G7 (or G9, G7b13) | G–A–B–C–D–Eb–F |
| Locrian #2 | A-7♭5 | A–B |
Hello fellow guitar theorists!
What do you hear in your head when you slowly read the next line?
"All my troubles seemed so far away."
Yep, it's that emotionally-packed melody line from Yesterday by The Beatles.
The powerful effect that comes from this melodic moment stems from the melodic minor scale.
As a continuation of a guitar scale lesson series that I've been doing, this week's lesson covers:
• The theory structure of melodic minor • How Bach and Paul McCartney used the melodic minor scale • The five melodic minor scale guitar patterns and how to practice them
Has the melodic minor scale mystified you in the past? (It did to me for years!)
If so then this video should help to clarify why this unique and rather odd scale exists and how to use it.
I hope you find it helpful or inspiring and that you have an awesome week full of music and creativity.
- Jared
Can someone please explain to me how to use melodic minor's natural minor descent in a musical setting (not just running up and down the scale). Thanks in advance!
Hey, couldn't find any resources which lay out various scale and chord diagrams so I guess I needed to make some of my own. If anyone knows of any accessible resources for all fourths tuning (all 4ths tuning) please share.
Diagrams below, all in the key of A:
(does not cover everything)
Major Modes
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/m3mdqqm
Melodic Minor Modes
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/d2ycx5z
Harmonic Minor Modes
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/rcirvrp
Pentatonic (just the Major and Minor Mode)
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/hdo9uox
Triads
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/wejwosn
Quadriads / Seventh Chords
https://www.editor.guitarscientist.com/view/fo5zhue
If the melodic minor scale is different ascending than descending, how do we know what chords and melody to play?
I never understood why in classical music theory the melodic minor scale is different when ascending and descending. Doesn't changing the intervals between the scale notes change the scale ?
Like if I play the natural minor ascending instead of descending?
Hello fellow guitarists!
What do you hear in your head when you slowly read the next line?
"All my troubles seemed so far away."
Yep, it's that emotionally-packed melody line from Yesterday by The Beatles.
The powerful effect that comes from this melodic moment stems from the melodic minor scale.
As a continuation of a guitar scale lesson series that I've been doing, this week's lesson covers:
• The theory structure of melodic minor • How Bach and Paul McCartney used the melodic minor scale • The five melodic minor scale guitar patterns and how to practice them
Has the melodic minor scale mystified you in the past? (It did to me for years!)
If so then this video should help to clarify why this unique and rather odd scale exists and how to use it.
I hope you find it helpful or inspiring and that you have an awesome week full of music and creativity.
- Jared
Why is the 6th and 7th scale degree only raised on the way up in a Melodic minor scale but natural on the way down? How does this apply to when writing music?
Thank you for all your replies. It’s very interesting seeing everyone’s take on this
